Mindbender
WL 355 – Sunday, March 18 – 10pm
Purveyor of: Acute lyrics and winding flow.

To call Mindbender a fixture of the Toronto hip hop scene is an understatement. The man who hosted In Divine Style for 5 years has been rhyming for almost 15, both as a solo artist, and as a part of Supreme Being Unit with his brother Conspiracy, all the while doing all he can to help build the scene around him. His dense lyrics and unconventional delivery have won him the accolades of industry greats and the respect of his peers, yet Mindbender is not resting on his laurels and anticipates this year will be his biggest yet. Malcolm Smith sat down with Mindbender at a café on Queen St. to talk about hip hop in Toronto, his evolution as an artist, and what his plans are for the 2k7.

Listening to the Beautiful Mutant album, the lyrics seem fairly optimistic. Is that a reflection of yourself?

Yeah, it really is. I'm growing - I'm almost 30 now, but I have a kind of timeless perspective on life. I don't want to be like "Oh, I'm almost 30, I've failed because of ..." I've met tons of my idols, I write for Pound... yeah, I try to be optimistic. Beautiful Mutant is mostly my thoughts, on my next album I want to talk about my life experiences, not just what's going on in my head.

On your newer tracks from your mixtape the lyrics seem angrier, where are you at today in terms of writing?

I'm talking about my actual life experiences. I'm kind of in an employment struggle; the magazine industry in Toronto is a little shaky with regard to hip hop writing. Pound only comes out 6 times a year, so that can't be my bread and butter. It's difficult being a Toronto artist, everyone knows the story.

So do you always represent yourself in your lyrics, or do you sometimes step into a character?

These days I'm really trying to write differently, a million different approaches. Sometimes I'll just think of lines that I want to say, social observations that I want to put out there. Before I used to just literally put words together and link them, and try to conjure images and thoughts in peoples heads, a lot of heavy wordplay. Now I want more of the sledgehammer approach. Stay in a slim frame of reference in a song with respect to themes and emotions.

Beautiful Mutant seemed like a very personal project...

It was probably my most personal project with the exception of the mixtape I put out. I was going through a bit of a depression, at the end of 2005, just because of the Canadian industry and whatnot. I also wanted to talk about my family and friends, and have music like that where people connect. One of the reasons that Tupac was so popular was that he put his life on record. People were galvanized by it, they either loved or hated him, but followed his every word. I love complexity and thought [in lyrics], but I was listening to the Eminem song 'Kim' the other day and thought, this is really so simple, but it's so powerful. I love Company Flow and Antipop Consortium to death, but sometimes it's good to just come with a straight forward knockout punch instead of that special 64 hit combo. So I'm looking to choose my words a lot more wisely these days, and say things that nobody else is saying in media or music.

Toronto doesn't get recognition for the hip hop talent that's here. A lot of people don't even bother checking for it, why is that?

I really think there's a Canadian inferiority complex, in a cultural sense. People assume it's better somewhere else, artists feel guilty about striving to be number one like American artists do. It doesn't have to be dog eat dog like America might be when it competes. We have some amazing world class artists; Kardinal, Saukrates. Personally I feel confident, I think my stuff is great. I've gotten praise from my heroes; El-P, Del... we're good here, why don't people support it? Maybe in my lifetime we'll see Toronto or Canadian hip hop really proud of itself.

Back when Flow 93.5 was starting there was talk about finally having a voice for Canadian "urban" artists on the radio. How successful have they been in representing Toronto or Canada?

Marginally. I don't want to be too critical of them; I know a few of the guys there that make the decisions of what gets played, but they just have too narrow a scope of what hip hop, r&b, or soul music is. You have to sound like a street rapper usually, or have production that sounds very typical, like Dipset or G-Unit. Canada has such diversity. Sure, we have crime here, but we have intellectual rappers, abstract rappers, poets, punchline rappers. I've never had a song played on Flow, never done an interview. I've been on Los Angeles radio, rhyming with Styles of Beyond, Talib Kweli, yet I don't fit into Flow's playlist, so it's kind of weird... The stuff they play that's Canadian sounds like the mainstream American stuff, yet we have a very distinct sonic culture, social culture, I don't know why it's not celebrated more.

A lot of rappers (Eternia, Maestro, etc) decide to leave the country and try to make their big break somewhere else, is that something you would consider?

I do make better connections with artists down there. With the mentality of my work and the way I see hip hop I relate more to American and international people than Canadians... some of my best friends here don't believe in themselves much or have high ambitions artistically or economically, I'm like 'Man, I want to be on the level of Pharoahe Monch, Ras Kass, Canibus, that's where I'm aiming, why aren't you aiming there?' Slick Rick is from England and he fits in with all the greats from the 80's; Big Daddy Kane, Chuck D. There's no reason why boundaries should limit your minds.

A guy from England pressed up my 12-inch from Fantasyland [Mindbender's first album] in 2002. He contacted us and said "Mindbender we love your shit, send us CD's and we'll put something out". So we did it, threw a release party, put it out in England and here. At the time I didn't want to go over there and then come back, but I sent an e-mail to him three days ago and was like "Dude, I give up, sign me to your European label." I'm that guy now.

So you're trying to have your new album released on a label?

Yeah. All my previous albums have been independently released, I've never been on a label before. Independence gives freedom, but there's more work than I'd ever like to admit. I want to be an artist, I have too many ideas to make all the phone calls and be a business all day. These days it's very difficult for an independent artist to find their fan base, or have them find you. I've marketed and promoted my stuff, but never to the extent that I need to. I've never had stickers or posters. I figure if I get on a label it will help that at least.

There's no Toronto centric hip hop label to help push the hip hop here is there?

Nothing for hip hop. Except for Urbnet, but Urbnet is national, plus they have artists from England, America. They're based out of Toronto, but they get unfairly swamped with stuff, there need to be three other Urbnet's in Toronto. There are so many artists here, and a lot of them are good. I literally saw over 500 artists in my five years at In Divine Style, and 15-20% of these guys are ready right now to establish fan bases, do tours, videos, have good careers. And maybe 50%, with some development, could be good too. But without the business structure here, it won't really happen.

Any Toronto/Canadian artists you want to mention who need more attention?

I love what Empire is doing. They're a really good local crew. They're like a mix of Boot Camp Click and Wu-Tang I guess. They're love it or hate it hip hop kind of, some of their songs are really vulgar. They're really hardcore, really street, but they're very lyrical. They're very concept driven; when they're talking about sex, it's some of the rawest shit you ever heard, or they'll have a song like 'Extra Extra' which is an amazing storytelling song about a mother who loses her sons to street violence. There's a guy called Knamelis, one of the best freestylers in the world I think, I love that guy. He's on his way up. I love Eternia, she's great, Collizhun is great, OK Cobra is really cool too. I'm a big fan of Buck 65 as well, Moka Only also. And to be honest man, I'll put this out there because I don't give a fuck anymore, maybe controversy starts from this but so will truth; I simultaneously love and hate k-Os. I love a lot of the music he makes, I don't like a lot of the political decisions he makes.

What do you mean by that?

Some of his choices and some of his antics, I'll say. It's like, man, you're a beacon in Canada right now, why are you blocking your own light, why are you blocking the light of others? I feel like he could be helping Kamau more, he's a phenomenal poet. He's on the last three k-Os albums, some people think he has the best verse on all the albums. I feel like he could be helping out the scene more. He's beyond hip hop, beyond urban music, he's one of the biggest artists in Canadian music. I feel like if I was in his position, which I really do want to be, I would shine some light back here. When I get there, I'm shining the light back and sho

wing people, look, there's tons of great artists here. On Beautiful Mutant I had eight or nine guests and six or seven different producers, I gave them all credit. k-Os, he has Buck 65 and Kamau on his new one, I don't know if he took production credit again on all his stuff like he did on Joyful Rebellion.

You're saying he doesn't produce the stuff he's credited for?

Not at all man, he pulled a Lauryn Hill. He doesn't play 19 instruments! I know some friends who have worked with him who will say, you know, "I'll submit it and get some money, but I won't get no credit!" All tracks produced by k-Os. Like, hmmm a George Martin production I guess, like "I'll sit back in the studio, turn that up, turn that down, chop that off, I'm sequencing it like this, this is my vision for your production." He's on some Dr. Dre shit now. At the same time I'd love to be where he is, and at the end of the day I respect him and I do like him. I want him to succeed and get beyond his troubles. You can criticize anyone. Here I am running my mouth about k-Os, what I gotta do is get Mindbender's shit on point!

So what's happening with your next album?

I'm approaching it very slow, I aim to have it out in the summer. I have a title, "All Mind's On Me". I haven't written it all yet, still choosing concepts, making the master plan. I'm being fairly ambitious again, I want to make another double album, make a big statement. I've got a very important concept I'm bringing on my new album about this earth and this life being heaven and how we're all gods and creators of our own destiny... not waiting until you die to enter heaven, create it right now in your life. So I want to talk about how my life personally has been that. I never used to talk about the weird little things that make up my life experiences; when I stayed at Abstract Rude's house, how Aceyalone brought me breakfast one day, Murs wanting to be the first to buy Beautiful Mutant. It's going to be very personal... I also want to have a lot of guests on there; a lot people that I think are slept on around here. I feel like this will be the best year yet.

I thought the Vangel productions turned out great on your last album, will he be returning for the new one?

Yup, but I'm probably not going to have any one dominant producer. I'll probably have 2 or 3 beats tops from anyone in particular. This is not guaranteed, but I've talked to Saukrates, Moka Only, Michie Mee, those are some people I want working on it, plus all the indie guys I know. I did a song with Collizhun, he's an amazing emcee and producer.

Anything you want to add?

Look out for Supreme Being Unit, a group with my brother, Conspiracy. He's in Edmonton right now, Toronto was a little much for him. That's another long story, but he and I have another album done, in the chamber. We came out with out first album when the Sebutones came out, and there were a lot of comparisons. Our next album is called "In Space No One Can Hear You Rhyme". It's 17 songs where we're both on every track and there's nothing out there like it. We're looking to drop it this year. I want to do a couple of side projects as well, a concept I'm thinking of called "Fear Killer", I really want to get to the root of fear of the world, because I think that's the obstacle to seeing the world as heaven. The media instils fear everyday, people's attitudes reflect that. I've also got an acappela album done, a concept album like nothing else in rap history.

No beats?

No beats, but there are movie samples and weird sounds... It's hard to describe, 70 minutes of poetry and insanity, it's called "Invisible Rhythm Showcase". That will be coming out this year, it's done, album cover is done, it's just sitting there, I just need to manufacture it. Plus my next album, the double LP, "All Mind's On Me", aiming for summer! And check out my webpage, www.supremebeingunit.com, my MySpace, www.myspace.com/mindbendersupreme!

by Malcolm Smith